Message no

Message no. 116
Posted by Dr. Suellyn Winkle on Monday, February 17, 2003 2:10pm
Subject Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

Questions for Class Discussion:

Chapter 4  The Breakout of the Visual

1)Explain, in your own words, Bolter’s concept of

Ekphrasis as a “reciprocal remediation” (56).

2)Comment on Bolter’s discussion of computer desktop

icons as examples of electronic picture writing.  How do

they function? (61-63)

3)According to Bolter, what is the future of text in

cyberspace? Do you agree?  Do you experience this shift

toward the visual in your own writing space?

Message no. 117[Branch from no. 116]
Posted by ANNE C BAATSTAD on Monday, February 17, 2003 2:52pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

1)  What Bolter is trying to get at in this section is

that reciprocal remediation, which is essentially

"backward remediation" or "ekphrasis", is what is

occuring in our magazies, websites, books, newspapers

and other literary substances for information and/or

entertainment. Reciprocal remediation is when "prose

tries to represent images" (pg. 56). Bolter states that

this process "sets out to rival visual art in words, to

demonstrate that words can describe vivid sceens without

recourse to pictures". A more modern example is how

directors are constantly attempting to make books into

movies. To me it seems that Bolter might be opposed to

this, and if this is the case, then I agree. Books are

so wonderful. Based on the WORDS, you develop a movie in

your head. you see the characters, hear them and feel

for them, just as in a movie. It always upsets me to

read a book by John Grisham (my fav. author!) and then

see the movies that are spawned, such as "A Time to

Kill" which stars Matthew McConaugh (I think I

slaughtered his name) in the movie. I love that actor,

but for anyone who has read the book, I'm sure that they

will agree that the movie didn't meet the

expectations.It totally ruins the visions that you had,

the perception, almost everything. And the story line

almost always changes. Grrr!

2) I must be a sceptic b/c at first I assumed that

Bolter despised those cute, helpful little computer

desk-top icons. However, I now realize that he only

means to address topics from both sides of the realm and

then addresses his own opinion. "Computer icons are

energy units that focus the operative power of the

machine into visible and manipulable symbols" and

"...electronic icons realize what magic signs in the

past could only suggest" state clearly the facts and

functions of computer icons (as well as Bolter's view),

which are to direct us to our desired program simply by

double-clicking on the appropriate icon. Icons are not

only to visually represent a program but can also be

used to delete programs, such as the infamous recycle

bin, which on my computer is a blowfish. :-)

3)Bolter believes that the future of simple text in

cyberspace is bleak. We will slowly, and eventually

totally, move toward the visual side of the cyberspace

spectrum. Although some sort of text will always remain,

it will mostly be of bright, colorful and creative sorts

that will consist of interlinks. "In the buttoned style,

to place more than a sentence or two of text on a screen

is an admission of failure, for the assumption is that

the designer should have been able to deploy a graphic,

a video, or perhaps an audio segment to communcate any

idea she has". (pg.72) Unfortunatly, I totally agree

with this idea. One day, cyberspace will exist as

nothing but a competition for audible text and graphics.

In my own cyberspace writingspace, I do experience this.

I find myself envious of more computer-skilled persons

who are able to make "better" websites; when I am here

typing a boring commentary and pasting it on a white

backboard, you have your opponent who has moving

graphics and her own voice recording informing you of

her commentary. This is the shift.

Message no. 118[Branch from no. 117]
Posted by Dr. Suellyn Winkle on Monday, February 17, 2003 2:58pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

Dear Anne:

I am old fashioned.  I don't want to be seen each time I

commmunicate! I suppose I wouldn't mind having my voice

heard--I like the phone--but I also like asynchronous

communication better than synchronous. Before message

machines I would turn my phone off regularly. I don't

like responding to the tyranny of the immediate.  I like

the privacy and the time that text and asynchronous

communication give me.

Message no. 119[Branch from no. 116]
Posted by CARLING ANNE MARTIN on Monday, February 17, 2003 3:14pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

In message 116 on Monday, February 17, 2003 2:10pm, Dr.

Suellyn Winkle writes:

>Questions for Class Discussion:

>Chapter 4  The Breakout of the Visual

>1)Explain, in your own words, Bolter’s concept of

>Ekphrasis as a “reciprocal remediation” (56).

The idea of "reciprocal remediation" between graphics

and text means the sharing and improvement of both the

verbal and the visual.  Ekphrasis is, according to

Bolter, simply when a prose is used to represent images.

 Reverse Ekphrasis occurs in film where a best selling

novel for instance, is turned into a full length movie.

It is popuar belief that this reverse Ekphrasis is

easier to decipher because these pictures are displayed

for you, whereas in Ekphrasis the reader must imagine

these pictures in her mind.

>2)Comment on Bolter’s discussion of computer desktop

>icons as examples of electronic picture writing.  How do

>they function? (61-63)

According to Bolter, the desktop icons or images are

reification of some aspect of information proocessing.

For example, when we see the folder with papers sticking

out of it, we know this means My Documents or the trash

can that symbolizes  where deleted files will go.  We do

not need the text underneath to know what they mean.

These icons tie together elements in the computers

writing space.

>3)According to Bolter, what is the future of text in

>cyberspace? Do you agree?  Do you experience this shift

>toward the visual in your own writing space?

According to Bolter, the future of cyberspace is all

about the images( the buttons we click on to get us

where we want to go,  the linked images that appear on

the homepage, or even the little :) smiley faces we use

in instant messaging).  The use of images doesn't mean

that there is a lack of words, its just how we get there

(to the actual text)or perhaps how we interpret  the

text because of the beforementioned images.  I

completley agree with Bolter.  If you think about it, we

shorten ourselves alot  when it comes to writing on the

computer.  We shorten our words and use emoticons to

express emotion.  We have icons that appear on our im

screen to convey an image or mood.  We shorten our

emails.  Everything is brief.  When you get on your

browser you are immediatly attracted to the visual

aspects, the picture of the President or the fallen

peice of the space shuttle.  These images are what

entices you, for the most part, to click on the link and

read the full story.

Message no. 120[Branch from no. 116]
Posted by MARK DEVALIANT on Monday, February 17, 2003 3:16pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

1. Ekphrasis as defined by Bolter is: prose trying to

represent images or other sensory experiences.  Bolter's

major contention is that visual media will "remediate",

or essentially make redundant, prose as the means by

which to communicate thoughts and ideas.  Ekphrasis is

attempting to do the exact opposite thereby, in Bolter's

world  of increased visual representation of the world

at large, he sees prose as still trying to outdo

pictures. Thus the idea that words remediate pictures,

or "reciprocal remediation".

  This seems counter-intuitive however. Taking the

example of sexual harassment. If the case arises that a

woman harasses a man, it is called "reverse harassment".

 But where is the reversal in the definition of

harassment? There is none. It is still harassment, the

circumstances of which are merely the reversal of the

norm.  Such I believe is the case for remediation.  Yes

it is contrary to Bolter's theories on the remediation

of print but is still in keeping with the theories

behind remediation itself.

2.  Bolter touches on the subject of icons used in the

GUI. They are shortcuts to other locations with a

computer.  By pictorially representing that which we

seek it is easy, and usefully universal (beyond the

contraints of written language), to access, "click and

go". They should not be confused with pictographs such

as the Sumerian/Egpytian hieroglyphs.  These, while

representing objects, also represent sounds and thus are

regarded as phonetic language symbols.

3.  Bolter sees little or no future for text in

cyperspace.  He takes this to the point of admoninshing

someone as a failure for the "last resort" of using text

on a web page, in the "button style."  I think that he

is right and that we can expect to have to read less and

less on webpages.  As more and more people create their

own personal webspace we are presented with greater

volumes of information to digest, not to mention the

reams of web-refuse courtesy our ever advertising ISP's

and "sponsors".

Not blessed with the luxury of time, as once I was,

there is little time for me personally to branch out in

new forms of expression.  There seems precious little

time to document thoughts and feelings as it is, so I

see the time I have to write a time TO WRITE!  I like

the process as one of creation and although I will never

be published, that feeling of having brought something

from nothing (tangible) is important to me and not

easily captured in icons, jpegs, mpegs and gifs.....

Message no. 141[Branch from no. 120]
Posted by ANGELA-ROSE MANESS on Wednesday, February 19, 2003 3:13pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

Mark,   I see what you are saying about the

"counter-intuitive," and I agree with the point that you

are making.  In my government class, we just learned

about reverse discrimination, and the same kind of

"counter-intuitive" view on the subject was presented.

For instance, if discrimination encompasses all

discrimination, then how can there be a reverse side to

it.  But there is no real reverse side to it, just a

reverse name.  I think that Bolter presents the idea of

"reciprocal remediation" when dealing with ekphrasis

just to clarify the concept behind ekphrasis.  After

reading your response, however, and hearing your opinion

in class on Bolter, I don't exactly agree with your view

on Bolter.  I don't mean that your view is wrong or

horrible.  It's just that I love his writing and ideas,

and I concur with everything that he says.  But every

person has his own opinions!  Don't take this in a bad

way because I am not trying to argue or anything like

that; I am just stating my opinion on your response.  To

tell you the truth, I really enjoy reading your

responses and assignments because I also like your usage

of words.  I think that you are a very intelligent man,

and therefore, I have could to think that I might be

missing something when I am reading Bolter because, thus

far, I have followed everything that he says without

doubting his reasoning one bit.  I laud you for putting

your own idea out there since it goes against the norm.

Also, I liked your responses on the second and third

questions, especially the third question.  I agree that

capturing your creation in a tangible sense is hard to

duplicate with "icons, jpegs, mpegs and gifs....."

Message no. 143[Branch from no. 141]
Posted by MARK DEVALIANT on Wednesday, February 19, 2003 8:12pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

Angela, my outburst in class was just theatrics. I don't

 really think that Bolter is a buffoon, but I don't

agree totally with his methodolgy.  He has on a number

of occasions made outrageous(in my opinion)

generalizations, contradicted himself at least a couple

of times, and it would seem placed himself firmly in the

court of the "remediation of print".  That of course

makes sense as this is the whole "tenet" of his book.

All that being said, I think that Bolter is mostly

correct. (Hmmm, who's sitting on the fence now???) I

think that we are moving away from the written word as

our primary from of "written" communication.  I'm just

not sure that it's for the reasons that Bolter has

jumped and for that I cannot sit still.  But I

appreciate the response to my response which in turn I

was able to respond to......

Message no. 121[Branch from no. 116]
Posted by ANGELA-ROSE MANESS on Monday, February 17, 2003 3:16pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

     In chapter four, Bolter presents the concept of

ekphrasis as a "reciprocal remediation" (56).  He

defines the term as "the attempt to capture pictures in

words" (74). Essentially, if remediation can be

described as the attempt of capturing words in pictures,

then ekphrasis would be its exact opposite.  Remediation

is the modern process that is happening regular texts

and linear literature alike, and ekphrasis is the

attempt at reversing the remediation process from

happening.  This process is mainly used by those

pro-linear literature people who are determined on

keeping books alive and dominant in our society.  After

reading the chapter, this process only makes sense

because of the importance and popularity of the visual.

We live in a visual era, where, as Jameson would say,

"the linguistic element...is slack and flabby, and not

to be made interesting without ingenuity, daring, and

keen motivation" (47).  Just by looking around, one can

see that the visual is a predominant element in our

culture.  For example, the Internet, hypermedia, movies,

billboards, and computer games are all essential and

popular parts of our society.  In order to keep readers'

attention, the author must be able to use words to

create such vivid images that immediacy is initiated and

the text seems to disappear before their eyes.  In a

world where the visual is clearly taking over, this,

which Bolter refers to as ekphrasis, is the only hope

for linear literature to stay alive in our society.

   I think that Bolter made a very good point in

emphasizing the importance of the visual when he

discussed the computer desktop icons as examples of

electronic picture writing.  He talks about how instead

of just writing what the icon stands for or what it

links you to with words one can express the same

expression in pictures, which are much easier for the

user to identify with and recognize.  This example shows

just how big and important the element of the visual is

today.  When capturing a title of something in words,

there is only one picture needed, instead of several

words, and it enlivens the desktop by making it more

interesting to look at.  When the computer user passes

his cursor over the icon and double clicks on it, the

icons take the user some other screen or program.  This

is very helpful for the user to access the screen or

program very easily and quickly for his convenience.  I

really love how Bolter talks about the icons and users'

fascination with them.  "Whenever she find  herself

admiring the simplicity of computer icons, she has

ceased to examine these elements as signs in a text.  In

the next instant she may resume her role as reader and

treat the elements as arbitrary signs, as glyphs in an

electronic alphabet," says Bolter, "This oscillation is

a characteristic of reading in the late age of print"

(63).  This characteristic is very fascinating to me.

The idea of losing yourself in the exploration of

imagination when looking at icons is very intriguing.

Desktop icons perform the job of simplifying a program's

accessability and presentation, and in my opinion, they

perform the job very well.       According to Bolter, in

the near future, text will have a totally different

configuration, which will be configured in cyberspace.

This writing space will take regular text, linear

literature, and make it a product of visualization.  All

text will be linked to one another or just a click away.

 Visualization will remain supreme, and the Internet

will make good use of images and immediacy, just like it

does today. I experience this shift towards the visual

every day. I agree with Bolter's idea on what ordinary

text will be like in the future.  This is no far off

guess and is quite legitimate when our societal

structure is examined closely.  Since cyberspace has the

capacity to turn text into visual images and can

implement the technique of immediacy so easily, then it

only makes sense that cyberspace will hold the key to

the future of text.

Message no. 132[Branch from no. 121]
Posted by SELENA EDWARDS RIESS on Wednesday, February 19, 2003 9:05am
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

I agree with your viewpoint about the visual becoming a

predominant feature of our culture.  I remember going on

trips as a little girl, and my favorite pasttime was

reading the billboards.  Not only did the billboards

hold my attention, they also helped the trip go by

faster.  Now, with the newer vehicles, there are such

features offered as a built-in mini television and a

VCR.  Clearly, the automotive industry has seen this

trend and is certainly catering to it.  Essentially,

with the future of prose geared toward the visual, it

looks like upcoming generations will be missing out on

the importance of text and the imagination it helps to

generate.  To me, the saddest thing is losing one's

ability to generate images from the written word and

relying on the visual to supply that image instead.

Selena Riess :o)

Message no. 159[Branch from no. 132]
Posted by DANIEL T TOTEV on Monday, February 24, 2003 2:37pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

I like your idea of the omnipresent visual technology,

Selena. Actually, it comes quite handy especially when

it concerns two or three years old kids. My nephew

Toshko used to raise hell when we chained him in his

baby-sit. There had to be at least two people in the

car: one for driving and the other for serving and

entertaining Toshko. But now my brother-in-law bought a

DVD-player and monitor for his truck and my nephew

cannot get enough of Blue’s Clues and SpongeBop. Toshko

is so into his cartoons, you’ll never heard his voice on

a four-hour trip.

Message no. 122[Branch from no. 116]
Posted by MELISSA M RIVELL on Monday, February 17, 2003 3:17pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

Questions for Class Discussion: Chapter 4  The Breakout

of the Visual

1)Explain, in your own words, Bolter’s concept of

Ekphrasis as a “reciprocal remediation” (56).

Ekphrasis=using words to describe or to "represent

images(or sounds or sensory experience)(56)". Bolter

uses this concept to explain how in the past, exphrasis

was the dominant method of expression for the old age of

print. Bolter attempts to tell us that the new age of

print calls for a reverse ekphrasis. We call for images:

in our television watching, movie-going, web-surfing,

etc. Bolter feels that we have a desire for visuals:

"Thus, in the 19th and 20th centuries, the desire to

capture the world in the word has been gradually

supplemented by the more easily gratified desire to see

the world through visual technologies"(58). The new age

of print is moving almost backwards with its dominance

of images, but now with the modern age's technologies

used to express and share.

2)Comment on Bolter’s discussion of computer desktop

icons as examples of electronic picture writing.  How do

they function? (61-63)

In Bolter's words "The functions of icons is to tie

together elements in the computer's writing space: to

show how documents are grouped and to connect the

documents to the programs that create them"(62). The

icons are what allow one to explore the writing space on

the computer. It gives access to the programs where we

create, to the documents we have already created, and to

areas where we can explore each other's documents. The

computer screen itself, with its icons, serves as a map.

It offers signs pointing us in the right direction.

3)According to Bolter, what is the future of text in

cyberspace? Do you agree?  Do you experience this shift

toward the visual in your own writing space

Bolter compares the world wide web to a magazine, with

its images and text in different order. He sees the

future as a remediation of every traditional form

becoming incorporated into the world wide web with new

technologies.   The text will simply enhance this

experience,a reverse ekphrasis in every form. The future

makes room for the remediation of television,

photography, radio and film as well as "animation,

streaming audio and video, and multimedia-style

programmed interaction" that has already been

incorporated into web pages.

I am a little stuck in my ways. I still find writing in

a notebook a good way to express myself, my thoughts, my

emotions. I rarely do so on the computer, except for

essays and classwork. I do enjoy emailing and talking to

people online. I am still very much into the textual way

of representing myself. I think that tthe world of text

still has a lot to offer. The future according to Bolter

sounds more interactive but I feel the need for keeping

text as just text.

Message no. 123[Branch from no. 116]
Posted by SELENA EDWARDS RIESS on Tuesday, February 18, 2003 11:38am
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

1)  Bolter's concept of Ekphrasis as a "reciprocal

remediation" relies on the visual picture that the

written word provides to the reader, "...the prose must

be descriptive in an effort to find the equivalent of

what is "naturally" a visual experience" (56).  The

reader should be able to perceive, or imagine, in his

mind, through descriptive writing, what a character may

look like and the tone of the words, whether they are

meant to be informational,happy, or angry, as well as

the type of setting "...in order to rival the visual..."

(56).  In essence, the reader learns through the visual

stimulation he receives through the written word.

2)  The idea that the computer desktop icons are

examples of electronic picture writing is interesting.

It opened my eyes to looking at my computer desktop in a

different way.  If one thinks about it, the icons are

representative, like pictures, of the files and programs

located on the desktop and "give the icon its meaning"

(62).  Without some type of representation, the desktop

would be a blank screen and simply "generic" (62).  The

icons function as a group that gives the viewer an

overall picture of where everything is located on the

desktop and what files are located in each icon.  By

alllowing the viewer to "connect documents to the

programs that create them" (62), the viewer is able to

view and "read the whole computer screen as a moving,

evolving diagram" (63).  It is almost suggested that the

desktop and computer really function like a TV does.

Each viewer selects the channel off his desktop for

where he would like to go, and thus, the viewer is

opened up to a world of live television.  The viewer not

only directs the program, but also is a part of the

action.

3)  The future of text in cyberspace does not seem to

have a positive outlook from Bolter's viewpoint.  Text

has been reduced to function as "...titles or merely to

identify buttons" (72) and "a paragraph of prose has

become a last resort..." (72).  It is quite sad to think

that the reader would prefer the more easily assimilated

graphics rather than taking the time to read the prose

neeeded to form that graphic image.

Actually, I don't agree that text is slowly losing its

meaning purely because graphics are easier and faster

for one's eye and mind to grasp.  Overall, the switch to

a more visual context seems to imply that readers or

viewers, as a whole, have become lazy and don't want to

take the time required to read information.  Although

the visual is a faster alternative when seeking

information, I find myself getting aggravated with all

the graphics that one must link onto to get "moving", so

to speak, in cyberspace.

I have found myself occasionally slipping into the

visual within my writing space, but I try not to let it

interfere with my writing.  With all the resources

available in cyberspace and in text, it is hard not to

resort to the easier visual image.  I have also found

that since my knowledge of cyberspace and all that it

encompasses has broadened, it has made me realize just

how important and fundamental the written word really is.

Message no. 127[Branch from no. 123]
Posted by MARK DEVALIANT on Tuesday, February 18, 2003 8:40pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

Selena, I think you've hit the nail right on the head. I

think people are just getting lazier and lazier. You can

see it in all walks of life not just in this context.

Funnily enough Bolter doesn't deny it, he just uses

clever catch phrases to cover it like "immediacy"

and"integration".

 But it isn't just lazy on the part of the reader.  Why

would an author, Thoreau would be a good example or

Hemingway, go to the trouble of describing the forest or

the sea when he can just paste in a photo?  Along with

these descriptions were research and actual experience.

That all seems like a lot of trouble and effort to go to

doesn't it?

Message no. 133[Branch from no. 123]
Posted by MELISSA M RIVELL on Wednesday, February 19, 2003 9:28am
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

Amen! I agree that the move towards more visual does

represent the laziness of people. Taking the time to

read may not be as quick and easy as a bunch of visuals,

but I think text is valuable and can offer a lot. I am

glad someone else appreciates text. I do like visuals; I

am a visual person, but I really enjoy reading and

writing. I think that text as an information source will

always exist, whether it is linked by a bunch of

graphics or is still in the now-ancient form of a book.

Good point there, Selena, on the laziness of visuals. I

agree!  ~Melissa~

Message no. 155[Branch from no. 123]
Posted by KELLY ANNE PURCELL on Friday, February 21, 2003 8:27pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

Selena, I liked your idea of the computer being like a

television.  We do channel surf, on both;)  The computer

is more textual and the television more picturesque.  I

wonder if they will come out with a new question on the

National Census (if it is not already there.. I never

seen one) asking, "Where do you find most of your

entertainment? On the Television or on a computer?"

Message no. 124[Branch from no. 116]
Posted by DANIEL T TOTEV on Tuesday, February 18, 2003 11:42am
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

1)     Contrary to today’s fashion of “transforming us from

readers to into viewers,” ekphrasis is the process in

ancient rhetoric, in which “prose tries to represent

images” /56/. First, since ekphrasis was the practice

used thousands of years ago and remediation is the

practice used only the last several decades, ekphrasis

is the initial affiliation between text and images.

Ekphrasis is the original transition: it is the reverse

process of today’s remediation. Kreiger sees ekphrasis

as a “desire for natural sign,” the desire “to have the

world captured in the word” /57/. To sum up, ekphrasis

is a process where the visual element is entirely

subsumed into text; it is a practice giving more freedom

to the reader to use his creativity and build his own

images on the base of text symbols.

2)     The desktop icon is a representative picture that

often has a name below it; it combines image and text.

Its function is “to tie together elements in the

computer’s writing space: to show how documents are

grouped and to connect documents to the programs that

create them” /62/. Its purpose is to change the screen

from a static page to “a moving and evolving diagram”

/63/.

It “oscillates between being sign and being image, or

rather it is the reader who oscillates in her

perception” /63/. First, the reader can be fascinated by

the icon but after everyday use he gradually ignores the

beauty of the image and starts to accept it as a symbol

of picture writing. Just like looking at a letter from

the alphabet or a word, he is not aware any more of how

the word looks; he is only interested what can be found

behind this representation. Thus, a desktop icon will

start to act as sign of picture writing or as a letter

from undefined computer alphabet. Actually, “verbal text

and image interpenetrate to such a degree that the

writer and reader can no longer always know where the

pictorial space ends and the verbal space begins” /66/.

According to Bolter, the ratio between text and images

might changes in favor of the visual in the future.

Hypermedia will have the control over text, because of

“its more authentic or immediate experience, than words

alone can offer” /58/. Bolter suggests that email might

be replaced by “the immediacy of a single voice and if

possible a face” /73/. I don’t agree with this point; I

believe that it will create a new kind of communication

similar to videophone, which might become more common

than writing an email. However, there is need of textual

communication too. Text has its own unique qualities

that can’t be substituted by images. According to Plato,

an ideal form can only exist in your mind, and it can be

represented only by text. For example, the written word

“dog” includes all breeds and their varieties one can

imagine, while a picture of a dog is limited to just one

combination of colors and shapes. And it is difficult to

use picture writing for some abstract terms like love,

beauty, or the number “two”. Let’s take beauty for

example. Often what one thinks is beautiful might not be

attractive for another: So what image are you going to

put a thin blond female or a dark-haired brawny male? Or

how do you visually describe the number “two” – with two

lines, two people, two planes, or two planets. Probably,

with audio recording rather than images.

What I believe is that technology might change the

environment in which we watch, listen, speak, read and

write; it may refashion text but it won’t make it

obsolete. Here’s something I already wrote in my

previous journals on Bolter.

I installed Windows XP on my computer two months ago and

I am still exploring it and am trying to find all the

new functions that came with it. Thus, I came up on

Microsoft Narrator, which is a text-to-speech program

that can help people with low vision set up their own

computers. When you switch on this program it reads any

text on your top screen. You can just click at the

beginning of a text with your mouse and it starts

reading it. One fashionable feature of this program is

that you can adjust the speed of reading: you can adjust

it to your speed of reading. The voice is a little

awkward and it speaks only English but now Microsoft is

working on better screen readers. Probably in the next

version of Windows this program will speak more

languages and it will offer a variety of smooth and

gracious voices. Then it will be not just helpful to

vision-impaired people but probably will be necessary

for everyone.

Then we have Dictaphone programs that allow a writer to

dictate any kind of information to a computer, which

converts the voice into text. These programs can make

keyboards outmoded, and probably change writing space to

some new kind of verbalized space for communication.

This new space perhaps will preserve the qualities of

print to pass text to next generations and it might

improve hypertexts’ characteristics including

“flexibility, interactivity, and speed of distributions”

(Bolter 3).

Some technologies today that try to look in the future

are the Apple’s new 7-inch laptop and the Pocket PC.

Pocket PC is five-by-three inches and not thicker than a

100-page book, and it’s easy to deal with: all you need

is the plastic pen to jump from site to site. It also

has the Transcriber, which is a program that let’s you

teach the computer to recognize your handwriting by

writing different letters and words on a blank screen

with the artificial pen. Then you become both writer and

a reader: you can handwrite everything you want on the

screen with the plastic pen and it converts it to text.

Therefore, if you like reading in bed and you want to

check emails and discussions’ postings under your

blanket, you might want to check these websites:

http://www.pocketpcpassion.com/default.htm

Or you can go straight to the Samsung Pocket PC Phone,

which is a cell phone and PC in one:

http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/

Or just look at it on page 80 in Bolter’s Writing Space.

Message no. 125[Branch from no. 116]
Posted by NATALIE A PETERS on Tuesday, February 18, 2003 5:18pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

1) Explain, in your own words, Bolter’s concept of

Ekphrasis as a “reciprocal remediation” (56).

Bolter defines ekphrasis as prose trying to represent

images. This goes back to the old saying of “a picture

is worth a thousand words.” This gives the idea that

images are better for portraying an “experience” to a

viewer/reader. The ideas of ekphrasis rivals visual art

with text, challenging that text can equal images in all

ways. When the example of novels becoming movies is

brought up, there are pros and cons to these ideas from

both sides. When someone reads a novel, they imagine

what the characters look like, what the settings look

like and they make up thousands of details that the

author could not possibly include. Two readers can read

the exact same novel, know exactly who they would cast

as the lead role, and these two ideas can be as

different as Jennifer Lopez and Meryl Streep. The

reader’s imagination is shot down as viewers watch

images (movies) and these details are made for them,

leaving no room for disagreement. This is just one way

that film is taking over as the most accepted medium of

our culture.

2) Comment on Bolter’s discussion of computer desktop

icons as examples of electronic picture writing.  How do

they function? (61-63)

Desktop icons give the impression of knobs on a

television set. You pick a “channel” and off you go.

This icon can help guide your way through all of the

“programs” on the Internet or just in your computer. Its

function is “to tie together elements in the computer’s

writing space: to show how documents are grouped and to

connect documents to the programs that create them”

(62). These icons, whether they represent a metaphorical

trash can or an open door to the Internet give each

computer an office-like organization as a place to work

without ever having to get out of your chair. Each

“desk” can be customized to fit each different person’s

needs, whether it is the background color of the screen

or the programs on the “desktop.”

3) According to Bolter, what is the future of text in

cyberspace? Do you agree?  Do you experience this shift

toward the visual in your own writing space?

Bolter doesn’t seem to be too happy about the direction

that text is going. He sees text as turning into a “last

resort – to be used when she runs out of ideas, time, or

production resources” (72). Bolter is correct when he

talks about images and what is appeasing to the eye and

what jumps out to the readers. He talks about the how

the two most widely used applications, electronic mail

and newsgroups are mainly textual and how they are not

likely to remain so. The ideas that video will soon

replace a regular email and the nightly news. Not all

text will disappear from communication, some documents,

he says, may continue to be transmitted, but “verbal

text will be further marginalized in the quest for

immediacy” (74).

I agree with some of Bolter’s views, but I find them

rather sad. Our culture has gotten so wrapped up in

making everything easy and fast, culture and art has

gotten dropped to the bottom of the list. The everyday

act of reading the newspaper has already progressed to

reading the paper online and soon you will be able to

watch the news on your computer. Myself, I like laying

in bed on Sundays and reading the paper. Call me old

fashioned. I can remember as a kid jumping in bed with

my parents as they read the Sunday newspaper. Bolter’s

ideas are like mine in the way that I feel like telling

the world to slow down and not always worry about the

next-best thing. I want my kids to jump in bed with me

later in life and laugh at the comics section. So, in

conclusion…. SLOW DOWN!!! ;)

Message no. 126[Branch from no. 116]
Posted by SUMMER A SMITH on Tuesday, February 18, 2003 7:26pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

1.) Bolter's concept of reciprocal remediation in terms

of ekphrasis refers to the attempt of the written word

to create imagery for its reader. Bolter explains the

importance of this concept when discussing prose as

being primary and graphics being secondary - or exactly

the opposite. He hints at the suggestion that perhaps

graphics have never been secondary to prose - that prose

only immulates an image or other pieces of sense data.

2.) Bolter presents the point, when speaking of GUI

icons, that like picture writing, icons are not merely

representations, they fufill a dual responsibility as

actual texts and as representations. Their function is

also to "tie together elements in the computer's writing

space," much like that involved in picture writing.

3.) Bolter argues that text is slowly vanishing from

cyberspace - that more immediate texts (pictorial,

moving) are becoming dominant within its perameters.

Personally, I've noticed the shift, but don't see prose

disappearing completely. I think the two (graphics and

prose) compliment eachother. Most definitively, I

believe prose is able to sustain its existence

independently, the same isn't true for the image.

Message no. 128[Branch from no. 116]
Posted by MARK DEVALIANT on Tuesday, February 18, 2003 8:41pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

http://www.niulib.niu.edu/thoreau/

Message no. 129[Branch from no. 116]
Posted by JAMES ANDREW FOGLE on Tuesday, February 18, 2003 8:55pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

In message 116 on Monday, February 17, 2003 2:10pm, Dr.

Suellyn Winkle writes:

>Questions for Class Discussion:

>Chapter 4  The Breakout of the Visual

>1)Explain, in your own words, Bolter’s concept of

>Ekphrasis as a “reciprocal remediation” (56).

>Bolter is trying to explian that Ekphrasis as the "reciprocal remediation," is when the process of technology keeps getting better and better throughout time.  Graphics are being used to replace text, and prose try to represent images.  Bolter says that "we can disern the ambivalence that belongs to ekphrasis as a strategy for remediation."

>2)Comment on Bolter’s discussion of computer desktop

>icons as examples of electronic picture writing.  How do

>they function? (61-63)

>They function of electronic picture writing is when you use icons with names on them to organize them, and they are given actions when clicked on.  They also function as documents and programs.  Bolter just simply goes into detail about how they are used, they appearance, and explaining their functions.

>3)According to Bolter, what is the future of text in

>cyberspace? Do you agree?  Do you experience this shift

>toward the visual in your own writing space?

Bolter says that text in cyberspace will be very useful

and user friendly, and will make life  a lot better.  I

agree with him, because as technology gets better and

better, are lives become easier and easier.

Message no. 130[Branch from no. 116]
Posted by KELLY ANNE PURCELL on Tuesday, February 18, 2003 9:39pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

1. It is hard for me to put ekphrasis in my own words as

Bolter describes it so well.  Ekphrasis is the

reciprocal remediation of text to graphics.  It is using

alphabetic writing in a very descriptive and easily

imagined way in order to create a mental image of the

idea.  Doing this makes the idea clearer and more

personal. More direct.  It makes the text easily

understandable to the reader who does not take a piece

of paper and a pen and create a outline of the chapter.

I believe that it is comparable to onomatopias.

This is a strong argument for Bolter and our class in

the idea that text is on the way to becoming full

circle... from cave art to novel back to graphics.

2. Icons really are a form of art in that people get

different ideas of what the topic will be, based on the

icon, as in music or poetry.  The surfer may immediately

and automatically make a decision on what the topic will

be, who wrote it, what the central point will be, or an

opinion on realism.  It seems like it would be very

close to the techniques of scientists and archeologists

in deciphering hyroglyphics.  It is true picture

writing.

Icons are so very basic that they are some of the first

things one sees when setting up a computer.  The Control

Panel is completely iconic.  In order to throw out a

file, we move it to the recycle bin.  We are computer

environment friendly... too bad we don't seem to be so

earth environmentally friendly!

I agree with Bolter that these icons are determined

visual competition.  For example, advertising is a huge

competion in surfing the web, especially when using

programs such as AOL.  Moreover, the home page of AOL is

completely iconic.  Do programs like these anticipate

the user as being not quite literate, or do they think

that we are just stupid?

3. According to Bolter, the future of text in cyberspace

is diminishing.  Maybe in a few years we will be able to

choose pure graphics or check the box for subtitles.  I

imagine just as technology is advancing and the quest

for knowledge deepens, the quest for shortcuts and

simplicity will continue.  As Bolter wrote, "Verbal text

will be further marginalized in the quest for

immediacy." (page 74)

I do agree that graphics, along with text, and the idea

of video email, etc., is good for context although not

for the life of the old fashioned novel wherein the

reader can create his or her own concept of the

characters or settings.  I do think that it might allow

for a lack of education that has been necessary up until

now; it may allow people to get slack.

I have never seen a MOO, but the first thing I thought

was, "This is like Joe Camel targeting kids."  The

cartoonic graphics can easily pull children into chat

rooms and get them hooked.  I also think (even further

down the crazy line) about people that meet on the

internet and get married a few chats later.  This video

email and chat surely will just emphasize this hysteria!

Message no. 137[Branch from no. 130]
Posted by NATALIE A PETERS on Wednesday, February 19, 2003 3:05pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

I like the idea of pictures moving to text and then back

to pictures. This "full circle" is quite ironic in the

modern day. Starting with cave pictures, we moved onto

text thinking we were all modernized, and now, we are

more modernized so we move forth to moving pictures.

(Lots of moving, I'm sorry!) It makes me think what

would have happened if text had never come out full

force, where we would be now. Would pictures be our

text? Would we live our day to day lives through a bunch

of so-called "icons" and "symbols?" Newspapers would be

non-existent and magazines would probably be in the

forfront. Of course text would have to evolve somehow,

or people would speak in icons?? That doesn't seem like

a realistic possibility.

I'm glad text is dominant. I, like others express myself

through writing. I hardly think I could do as well if I

had to deal with a bunch of pictures or graphics. On the

other hand artists have been portraying ideas and images

for years but no one gave them credit for a

"breakthrough" now did they???

I'm thinking abstractly today. I think when I fell it

knocked something loose in my brain. ;)

Sincerely, The Girl Who Fell on Her Butt

Message no. 144[Branch from no. 137]
Posted by SHERRY M ISLER on Wednesday, February 19, 2003 8:14pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

"Would pictures be our text?" -Natalie (A.K.A. girl who

fell on her butt) Pictures were our texts when we were

toddlers; remember we begin learning how to read text

with simple books that are primarily pictures depicting

a certain word or short phrases.  As we advance and can

comprehend more and more text, the visuals become less

and less until we were no longer reliant on the visual

images for learning.  The visual image we would create

ourselves from the text was sufficient and often more

rewarding. So to tie in some other responses, Natalie's

response, and connect my thoughts would basicly be: we

begin with simple graphics that help us understand and

learn, building up our vocabulary, then progress to more

and more text as we are able to comprehend on more

intellectual levels and then as we get older and perhaps

more lazy or just more concerned with leisure, we

regress to more graphic centered media such as

television, movies, magaizines, etc...

Message no. 145[Branch from no. 144]
Posted by MARK DEVALIANT on Wednesday, February 19, 2003 8:36pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

Sherry, I like the way that you implied, deliberately or

not, that the images were simplistic and only a stepping

stone to the real stuff, text.

Message no. 147[Branch from no. 144]
Posted by NATALIE A PETERS on Wednesday, February 19, 2003 11:34pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

I do understand that pictures were our text as children,

then as we grow older, we become less reliant on them

for learning. What I was saying is what if text had

never evolved?? I know this is a far shot, but the "what

if's" are endless... What if newspapers were like

picture books, almost like a comic book without

dialogue?

About the full circle, this is a far-off comparison, but

I think it could work:

Ok, we said before that we went from pictures to text

back to pictures (graphics)...Sherry compared pictures

to childhood... This "circle" of pictures-text-graphics

could that be compared to childhood-adulthood-elderly??

Yes, this is a long shot, I realize, but when Sherry

pulled them together, it made me think of comparing the

two... call me crazy, like I said, I'm thinking

abstractly today!

This is how I see it: when we are kids, we learn through

pictures because they are appealing to the eye... as we

grow into adults, pictures are replaced with text...

when we grow old (and I'm talking old) we can't see

anything more than an inch away from our faces, so

pictures are your best bet.... there are deeper meanings

to this comparison, but that's the best thing I could

think of right now.... eh??

And for the record, my butt is still sore... :(

Message no. 154[Branch from no. 147]
Posted by KELLY ANNE PURCELL on Friday, February 21, 2003 8:14pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

I believe that conversational interactions between

humans, from birth, are what mostly builds vocabulary.

Children learn so much from the people around them. We

are taught vocabulary and how to read using pictures, as

in the new toy/educational experience for children

called "Leap Frog," right down to being able to

recognizing the color red.  They all tie in together to

some kind of understanding. The more we experience the

farther our vocabulary progresses.  Text and pictures

both hold formality and intensity.

I think it is interesting to see how context is affected

by the use of pictures.  Context is so important,

considering how easily people are misunderstood.  Like

in conversation over the phone, you can hear the words

but not see the other persons reactions. When you are

face to face you can see the reactions and possibly

better understand what the other person is  saying.  No

one has the same personal interpretation as someone

else, therefore context is important. Pictures, from

childhood, provide context which sometimes is more

important in teaching the meaning, from simple

conversation to complicated text.

In addition, technology has been changing text by using

a keyboard to produce text instead of a pen or pencil.

The way we write has evolved as much as anything else.

How many of you type your responses right into the

computer without first  writing drafts?  Moreover, you

can sign federal documents (taxes) over the internet; a

written signature is no longer required! Wow, this type

of thing makes me a bit nervous but it is also making my

life a little easier with every passing day.

 P.s. I liked the humor and irony in Natalie' reference

to child-adult-elderly  :0)  <--graphics for context.

Message no. 165[Branch from no. 154]
Posted by DANIEL T TOTEV on Monday, February 24, 2003 4:09pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

Kelly, you brought up an interesting point - the

importance of visual context or non-verbal

communication. Some people see words only as the tip of

an iceberg. Words by themselves without gestures,

tonality, and face expressions can be misinterpreted. On

the phone you have words and tonality, but you still

cannot see the facial response. Chat rooms like ICQ and

Yahoo are even worse, because they completely take away

the body language. When I came here in USA I was several

times misunderstood by my friends in Bulgaria –

something that never happens when I am there speaking

face-to-face. That’s why I don’t like very much Chat

Rooms. The case with email is different: there you are

not responding immediately but you have time to check

what you have written and you can use some of the

not-so-genuine smiles like this one :)

Message no. 185[Branch from no. 165]
Posted by ANNE C BAATSTAD on Wednesday, February 26, 2003 2:12pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

Daniel,

The point that you and Kelly have pointed out are so

true, and FRUSTRATING! I've also had several cases in

chat rooms or on the phone when the other

conversationalist isn't fully understanding me, and then

a fight might occur all based on the problem that they

can't hear my tone or see my expressions!! AGH!

Message no. 131[Branch from no. 116]
Posted by SHERRY M ISLER on Tuesday, February 18, 2003 11:58pm
Subject Re: Wk 6 Questions for Class Discussion

1)  Bolter's concept of Ekphrasis as a "reciprical

remediation" is basiclly saying that written word (or

prose) has become replaced with a greater emphasis on

pictures or visual images as opposed to how emphasis

used to be the other way around.  Where "we get a

reverse ekphrasis in which images are given the task of

explaining words" (56).  Bolter brings up the concern of

this reversal from text to visual emphasis and doesn't

seem to be completly for one media or the other; he's

staying somewhat neutral and presenting both sides

before he'll reveal his preference.

2)  "The function of icons is to tie together elements

in the computer's writing space: to show how documents

are grouped and to connect documents to the programs

that create them."  Icons are an identifying tool for

the desktop in which we recognise and associate each

icon image with its particular function or domain

without even realizing we do so.  It's like an

involuntary function that just occurs naturally because

it's the "norm" in our cyber-emphasized society.  We see

a certain image that is given to us and immidiatly link

it to it's intended function or association.  It goes

back to the ever-present debate over "passive learning";

that our society has gone so far from emphasis on

written text because of the convience and access to

"passive" media outlets such as television, radio,

movies, etc.  Television and movies give you the image

with the story, there is no room for imagination or

self-imaging.  You are a passive observer with no

options to the visual image of that character in the

movie, or that story subject being depicted on the

evening news.  So then whenever that subject is brought

up, your mind immidiatly links that designated visual to

the subject.

3)  The future of text in cyberspace, as I interpretB

from Bolter, is highly linked to advancements in visual

imaging.  I agree with this advancing imaging emphasis.

Look at where we are now and the advances society is

making toward imaging: cell phones double as digital

cameras where you can instantly send an image, websites

are loaded with images that link to related topics,

greeting cards with dancing images and synchrinized

music,--even my yahoo messenger is full of little visual

"emotion" images to select to sprinkle in my text.

There are so many emotion images that break barriers

allowing an attempt at emotions that cannot otherwise be

displayed visually through cyberspace.  The capabilites

are being expanded and limitations becoming less and

less limiting as a result of the expansions.  The future

of technology and imaging is only going to get more and

more advanced and hopefully more personable to an

otherwise, less personal method of text than traditional

methods.